If You Can't Say Anything Nice

The interview had gone fine so far, and we were just finishing up.

"So, if you don't mind my asking, what other schools are you thinking of?"

"Well," the guy I was interviewing volunteered, "I'm also applying to [well-known East-Coast engineering school], but MAN I think that place sucks!"

"Uh, really?" I said. "How so?"

"Well, I mean, the students there are all so dorky, and there's just no social life whatsoever. And the facilities are kinda old and run down. I applied there because my parents wanted me to, but I just think it'd really suck to go there."

"Well, if you didn't want to go there, why didn't you tell your parents?"

"Well, I mean it's a good school and all, I guess, and worst-case I think I can probably get in--my dad went there. But I mean, don't you think it's a crappy place? I mean, have you ever met anyone from there who doesn't suck?"

"Sure, I know some people who went there. They seemed to have survived."

"I guess... I'd just hate to have to go there. I'd so much rather go to your school!"

Ding.

Advice
Look, everyone knows that every applicant has a hierarchy of schools they're applying to--some you're excited about, some you'd be OK with, some are fall backs. That's the way the process works.

But, under no circumstances, is it EVER a good idea to trash another school during your interview--although you'd be shocked how many students do. Why?

First, you have nothing to gain by trashing another school. Maybe--maybe--you can get away with a playful jibe at a rival school: Make fun of applying to UC Berkeley as a backup if you're applying to Stanford, for instance. But even that is risky and doesn't gain you much of anything--don't risk it.

Trashing other schools makes you look petty and juvenile--precisely what you want to avoid in your interview. It definitely calls your judgement into question. You risk insulting your interviewer (never know where your interviewer's spouse, siblings or friends went, for instance). Worse yet, given that you probably didn't trash that school when you were interviewing there, it makes your interviewer wonder what you really think about his or her school--are you being equally tacky when interviewing with other schools?

Plus, come on, it's just bad manners. What did mom always say? If you can't say something nice... So don't be a dolt.

How should you handle the "What other schools are you applying to?" question?

This is actually the bigger issue--what do you say when your interviewer asks where else you're applying. Sometimes they're just curious. Sometimes there's a bigger reason--they want to know whether their school is your safety school, your middle-of-the-pack school, or your stretch/aspirational school.

Might your Princeton interviewer question how serious an applicant you are if they find out every other school you're applying to are local state schools? Maybe.

So first off, don't volunteer your application list if you're not asked--it's none of your interviewer's business anyway, and you don't gain anything by bringing it up.

But, if asked:

• Politely defer, if you can. "I'm still finalizing my list. I applied early to your school though because it was my clear-cut top choice" or "I'm applying to a number of other schools with similar reputations and selectivity, but the outstanding drama program at your university sets it apart as my top pick."
• If pressed, be honest. "I'm applying to six schools, yours, X, Y...."
• Should you fib? This is tricky--if you're applying to 30 schools because you're completely indecisive and couldn't figure out what you wanted, probably best not to volunteer that--your interviewer will (probably correctly) judge you as a not-very-serious applicant. Likewise, if every other school you're applying to is ranked far below the one you're interviewing for, it might be best to fib that you're considering a couple of peer institutions. Just be careful--you might be asked about that school, or in some other way be found out. (I heard a story of an applicant who went on at length about their interview experience at another school--only for their interviewer to point out that the other school doesn't interview. Ouch.)

As always, this comes down to good manners. Don't be a cretin--don't trash other schools in your interview, even if given the opportunity--and you'll avoid a surprisingly common pitfall. ----CJ

News: More Advice To Fill Your Summer

Two college-application-related advice stories of note--one worth reading for the content, one worth reading because the comments are pretty funny.

First, the article you really should read: The New York Times has a piece up by Marty O'Connell, executive director of Colleges That Change Lives, a non-profit focused on helping students find the best college for their them. (link is here)


In it, O'Connell gives some good advice about how to go beyond the rankings to find the right college fit--and why you should consider expanding your horizons. Conceptually, I agree--not every valedictorian is should go to an Ivy League school.


However, O'Connell writes: "Employers and graduate schools look for outstanding skills and experience, not college pedigree. " Which is... sadly, not really the case. Graduate programs are probably more open to obscure schools--they're in the same industry of higher education afterall, so they understand the role of smaller, liberal arts institutions.


Employers? Sadly...not so much. After graduation, I worked for what's probably considered a "marquee" employer, but speaking from my experience, we only recruited at "top" (ie name-brand) schools. If you were a rockstar at a small school we'd never heard of? Sorry, you never had a chance. Should have gone to MIT.


But should you go to Princeton if you hate it just to get the "right" job afterwards? Of course not--life is about living and enjoying the moment, not positioning yourself for some future step. And things always work out in retrospect--if you have a great experience at a more obscure school, you'll never be able to imagine going anywhere else.


But to say that school brand doesn't matter is pretty disingenuous.

On a lighter note, have a blast checking out the top-5 college application tips, published in the Boston Globe. From his new book (anyone not have a book to pimp?), the "legendary guidance counselor" tosses out such nuggets as:

1. Research schools by looking at guide books and going on the Web.

Really? You can learn about schools on the interwebs? Truely sir, you are a legend. ---CJ

News: College Counseling Snake Oil

For anyone who missed it--the New York Times had a front-page article on Sunday about college admissions counselors. Among other things, the article pointed out that--make sure you're sitting down, this is going to be a shock--many if not most have dubious credentials (at best) and are often a complete rip off.

Check out the original article here. (Including, of course, another reference to the now-famous $15,000-what-to-wear-to-your-interview consultant). (Today's followup is here)

Here's the point of the story:

“I guess there are snake oil salesman in every field,” said Amy Gutmann, the president of the University of Pennsylvania, “and they are preying on vulnerable and anxious people.”

Here's the truth: Applying to college is something of a crap shoot. There are a lot of stellar candidates, and very marginal elements--a slightly better essay or test score, a slightly better interview or teacher's recommendation--will make or break your application. And, as much as admissions officials hate to admit it, at the margin there's a lot of luck---with tens of thousands of applications to sort through, how could there not be?

If someone's guaranteeing you admissions for an outrageous price tag (and $40,000 is outrageous), they're lying. No one can guarantee you anything, and legitimate counselors would be the first to admit that. Save your money.

Or, if you simply must hire someone, make sure you get their credentials and (if possible) check--did they really do what they claimed to do? Or are they claiming to have been the head of admissions, when really, they were just a summer intern?

Sadly, as with everything else, it's buyer beware.... for a slightly more jaded take, make sure to check out this ---CJ

PS --- I've written this before, but I'll state it again. I'm not an admissions counselor. I've never worked in an admissions department. My focus is on teaching you how to conduct your college admissions interview the best you possibly can, based on more than 10 years of conducting interviews for my alma mater, a top-10 institution, in multiple cities with dozens of students.

Favorite Questions: What's your passion?

A number of you have asked about specific questions that I or other college interviewers use a lot, and how to answer them best. This is the first post in an occasional series I'll run profiling specific college admissions interview questions you should be ready for--and how to (and not to) answer them. --CJ

Question: What are you passionate about? (Alt: What are you particularly devoted to? What do you spend most of your time on? What makes you tick? Etc)

Background/why you're being asked:
Most interviewers meet with multiple--sometimes dozens--of students, all of whom tend to look pretty similar: Good grades, smattering of extra-curricular activities, etc. What they want to know is how you stand out. What makes you different from the pack--and thus worthy of admission? (and yes, they want to lump you into a category)

Some schools also pride themselves on having eclectic classes--the nation's foremost tuba player, the western-region champion fire juggler, etc. For these schools especially, it's critical that you have something that really sets you apart.

Finally, sometimes, your interviewer is also just fishing for a conversation topic. Maybe you and your interviewer share interests (probably not), but regardless, there's something you can talk about for a few minutes.

How NOT to respond
How do you screw this up? Easy--there are really two main flubs:

• First, don't have a response. High-caliber students tend to be more engaged in the world around them, and thus be passionate about something. You don't have to be the world's expert, but by the time you're 17, you should have some interest in something. No passion=not engaged=not high caliber=ding. You're being given a wide opening to distinguish yourself from the pack--you need to take that opportunity to talk about your core interests.
• Second, lie. If you claim to be passionate about literature--but then can't hold a conversation about any books you've read--you're going to come across as shallow at best, or insincere at worst. Expect your interviewer to follow up on whatever you claim to be into--and potentially to be an expert in your area.

Also, watch looking like a lightweight in your area of interest. If you're passionate about the flute, but are 5th chair in your high school band and have never distinguished yourself, you're going to come across as a lightweight (at best). Ditto the literature aficionado whose favorite book is Huck Finn. Every 9th grader in America reads Huck Finn. Pick something else.

How to nail it:
Easy:

• First, obviously, be ready for it. Since you've been reading my posts, you're already ready with an elevator pitch and the three things that set you apart. This is an easy window to launch into that (if you haven't already done so in your interview--and if you already have, you probably preempted this question already by talking about your specific passions and interests). Try to keep it simple too: "I'm passionate about helping others" or "I'm really interested in chemistry" or "I'm really devoted to playing guitar". You want your interviewer to think "guitarist -- got it" and ask "so what is it about playing guitar that you particularly enjoy?" Presto! You're distinguishing yourself as an applicant.
  
• Second, be ready with support. You're guaranteed to get a follow-up question (typically "why?" or "tell me more about that?")--be ready to talk about your interest, and demonstrate your commitment. Passionate about the guitar? Why? ("I love learning about different styles of music" or "I find it a great way to relax and collect my thoughts after a long day at school"). Then support it ("I play in my school's jazz band" or "I play a couple of nights a month at the local coffee shop"). And if you've got accolades, all the better ("And I won American Idol last season.")
• Third, be ready to be challenged. Particularly if your passion is academic, you might have an interviewer who majored in your area of interest! Be ready to talk in-depth about your interest (again, this is why it's critical not to lie--you might get your bluff called!)

Finally, what if you really just don't have a passion? I'd argue that you do, you just haven't thought about it yet. Passions don't have to be highbrow--I've had both jugglers and video-game addicts--surely there's something that makes you unique from the rest of your peers. Whatever that is, that's what you should talk about.

However... if there really isn't, fess up to it and spin it:

"Honestly, I still haven't found an overriding passion in my life yet. I have a lot of interests--soccer, French, oboe--but nothing yet that I'm really devoted to. One of the things I'm most excited about in attending your university is the chance to explore more areas and uncover what it is that will be my passion in life."

It's both an honest response and makes another case for your admissions to that school--and beats "I dunno, I don't have one" by a long shot. ---CJ

What (Not?) To Wear

My 5:30 interview was right on time -- a good sign. However, there was another issue...

"Hey, thanks for meeting with me this evening," he said, shaking my hand. "I hope you don't mind, but I had to come straight from practice."

I'd already figured that out--the sweat-soaked t-shirt and running shorts were my first clue.

"Not a problem," I said. "These interviews are pretty informal. I'm just glad you were able to fit our interview into your schedule. To kick things off, tell me a little bit about yourself..."

The rest of the interview went fine--although by the time we'd finished, there was a no-mans-land circle around us where other coffee shop patrons had decamped for fresher environs. If you had to come straight from practice, don't you think you'd toss extra deodorant in the car?

Not really an immediate ding--just a "what really are you thinking?"

Advice:
I'd hope it goes without saying to 99% of people that you should try to give yourself enough time between your 10-mile jog and your interview to shower and change (if not, maybe ask to meet outside and pray for a strong breeze?).

But, more generally, what is appropriate to wear to your interview? (I'm assuming you didn't make the fashion show earlier this year...)

Sadly (from an ease standpoint), the advice "dress like you're going to church" no longer applies. Although I wouldn't hold it against you if you wore a suit to my interview, you'd probably feel out of place--which risks throwing you off your game for your interview. What to do?

First, what's the point in dressing correctly? You want to look the part--you want to show your interviewer that you're serious, that you're smart enough to understand what's expected of you, and you want to be comfortable in what you're wearing. Few things in life are as awkward as being completely inappropriately dressed, and if you feel awkward, you won't give your best interview.

Dressing inappropriately can hurt your ability to establish rapport and connect with your interviewer. It's also a distraction--you want the focus to be on you, not why you decided to wear your "Die Yuppie Scum" t-shirt to your Vanderbilt interview.

So, how to decide what to wear? First, dress appropriately.

Take a clue from the venue. Meeting someone at their downtown law firm? Chances are everyone there will be in a suit and tie--you probably should be too. Meeting someone at the local Starbucks? A suit is probably too much--better to go with nice casual (button down shirt and khakis for guys, skirt and blouse for ladies).

If there's a continuum of dress--t-shirt and shorts on one end, formal wear on the other--place your venue on that continuum, and then maybe go slightly dressier. So if you'd be comfortable at Starbucks in jeans and a t-shirt, probably better to step it up a notch and go khakis and a polo.

Again, you want to communicate to your interviewer by what you wear that a) you understand social convention and b) you take the interview seriously enough to dress correctly.

Second, when in doubt, ask. When your interviewer calls you to set up the interview, ask what you should wear. Ideally, your interviewer will tell you ("my office is still dress formal, so you should probably wear a tie"). Half the time though, you'll get "oh, it doesn't really matter--just wear whatever you're comfortable with", which is completely useless. If that's the case, default to the advice above.

(One trick--if the interview setting is an office, call back in to the receptionist at the front desk and ask her what visitors typically wear. Crafty!)

Third, be a little flexible. This is a little easier for guys. Say you're meeting at a Starbucks and you're wearing a sports coat. You meet your interviewer, and he's in khakis and a polo. Before you sit down, you can take off your jacket and hang it on the back of the chair--presto! You're dressed appropriately.

Still unsure? Generally, assume:

• Jeans, shorts and t-shirts are never acceptable
• More conservative is generally better (express yourself on admit weekend)
  
• Skirts or dresses are typically better for women
• Piercings should be taken out (if possible), tattoos should be covered (if practical). You want your interviewer to focus on you, who you are, what you've done, and what you say--not on your nose ring.
• Err on the side of being too formal (a suit and tie when it's unnecessary is typically better than khakis and a polo shirt when suit and tie are expected)

Also (pet peeve), go light on the cologne/perfume... being remembered as "the Chanel kid" isn't the impression you want to leave!

Final note. What if you're one of those "my clothes express who I am" types? First, you're probably going to wear whatever you want to anyway, so who cares?

Second, no matter who you are, you need to be comfortable in what you're wearing to do your best. If you really can't function if you're not wearing all black... then go for it. Just keep in mind that you're taking a slight risk that someone more willing to play along isn't. -------CJ

News: Get Paid to Wait

This is one of the best ideas I've heard of in years. According to the Christian Science Monitor:

More than 80 colleges and universities have started offering some matching grants for students who earn tuition assistance through AmeriCorps. At least 1,165 have signed on to match new government grants for veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan. And Princeton University and Dickinson College recently created programs to support public service, expecting that these students will bring a unique dimension to campus after spending time off the education track.

In other words, if you've always wanted to do community service full-time, here's your chance -- take a year off before going to school, give back to the community, AND get tuition assistance. Plus, as Princeton and Dickinson (which is going even further by offering a fellowship) quickly realized, having someone with a year's worth of community service under their belt adds to the student body (both in and out of the classroom).

Check out the full article here.

Also, a good list of "gap year" programs (both community-service focused and others) can be found here.

Now all we need is a gap-year option for bloggers.... ---CJ

(Don't) Freak out!

It's never good when your interviewee is visibly shaking--and, although she tried to hide it, my second interview of the evening was visibly shaking. She also was doing everything possible to avoid eye contact.

"Thank you for coming into town to meet with me," I said, smiling what I hoped was a reassuring smile that would put her at ease. "As I mentioned in my email to you, my interviews are pretty informal--just a chance to get to know you some, learn more about your background, interests, etc. Do you have any questions before we start?"

I thought she was going to puke. Instead, she just quickly shook her head.

"OK then. Well, just to start with the obvious, let's talk about academics. What's your favorite subject?"

"Ummm.... I really enjoy English," she offered, in a voice that I had to strain to hear. "And literature. I'm in AP literature right now. And I like that."

"That's great--I was almost an English major," I said. "What's the favorite book you've read so far?"

For a second I thought that I'd asked her to calculate the square root of 17 to eight places. She tried to keep her hands under the table, but it was still obvious they were shaking.

"Well, um..." her eyes darted around the room, "I actually loved Pride and Prejudice. Most people hated reading Jane Austin, but I liked it. "And...um, actually, I need to get a glass of water. Do you think I can get a glass of water from the barrista? Do you mind?"

Advice
If advice can be judged by the recipient's ability to implement it, I'm about to give you the most useless advice ever: calm down. If you're visibly nervous and look like you're about to puke, it's going to stress out your interviewer just as much--and destroy any chances you have of impressing your interviewer.

Personally, when I'm interviewing someone who's clearly petrified, I do two things:

First, I mentally knock their score down. If you can't handle having coffee with me for 30 minutes, how are you going to handle going to my school?

Second, I reign in the questions I'd otherwise ask to the most basic, non-panic inducing ones--thus reducing your ability to shine even more. I understand that everyone gets nervous before big events--and an admissions interview is clearly in the 'big events' camp. Short of knocking yourself out on Xanax, what should you do?

First, calm down. This isn't a Wall Street stress interview. Your interviewer really doesn't want to make you cry. He or she really does just want to learn more about you and determine whether you'd be a good fit for admissions to the incoming class. If it helps calm you down, consider this: Worst-case, you'll come across as an average applicant, fail to impress your interviewer, and your interview won't help your overall application any (although if you're reading this site, you should do better than that!) Very--very--few applicants do so poorly on an interview that they actively hurt their application. The majority are "nice, fine... nothing really special". That's not what you're aiming for, but if that's what you hit, it's not the end of the world.

Second, prepare! The more you know what to expect in your interview, the more comfortable and less nervous you'll be. Although going to the dentist is never fun, it's much more frightening the first time, when you have no idea what's going to happen. So read this site, read the school's material on the web, read interview tip books from your library--in short, prepare for your interview. If you know what to expect, you'll be less nervous.

Third, practice, practice, practice. Again, to pull teeth--the more times you go to the dentist, the more comfortable you are being there. Same with interviews. Have friends, family, teachers, counselors--anyone you can coerce into doing so--give you practice interviews. Learning how to talk about yourself isn't an art, it's a practiced skill--the more times you practice it, the more comfortable you'll be doing it (and the better you'll do).

Finally, try to schedule your top schools last. The more interviews you do, the better you'll get at it--you'll get used to the style (most schools' interviews are similar) and you'll get used to talking about yourself. Just like college sports teams open the season with a couple of games against lower-ranked opponents to work out the kinks in a live-game setting, you should schedule easier schools (or just schools you're less interested in) first. By the time you get to the ones that are more important to you, you'll have hit your stride and know what you're doing.

Despite all that, will you still be nervous? Of course--everyone gets nervous. But you won't let your nerves crush your interview chances. --------CJ